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Champions League...The truth?
  • brett
    Posts: 665
    It is at the centre of everything we are doing as a team at the moment. Time was when you would be looking to win the league, if that was looking unlikely then guaranteeing yourself a UEFA cup place was an afterthought. Not much difference on the surface apart from the fact that entry into the tournament was a thing in itself and not the main focus of winning the league. A year to play against players you hadn't seen or heard much of. And that was that.
    But is it bigger now? Chelsea won it last year but I am not sure that their profile has changed. Did the supporters feel anything more than the times they finished top of the league? And what will really stick in all our minds..the final game of last league season or any of the European games?
    So from my point of view ..the games are no more exciting than league ones, maybe less. winning it seems to bring no more prestige, long term memories or cash than winning the league would in itself.
    Then there is probably its big marketing point..foriegn markets. Obviously I know little about this, but it does seem like the top league teams from all over europe are shown in their league games and as recognisable because of that. Perosnally i would rather watch Madrid v Barca in the league than one of them playing Bayern in a european game.
    So as far as our ambitions go, there is no doubt fourth is crucial in terms of stability and financial development, as well as it seems holding onto our best player. But in footballing terms are we really any more excited about ending up in a group with little chance to qualify than watching the team build and maybe challenge one day for the title.
    No doubt its crucial to get there, but should it be, Is it a myth that has been created to generate cash and create an elite that are easier to market. Does it really benefit players and fans in terms of excitement, profile and memories?
  • escla
    Posts: 2,453
    Would much rather have a return to the European Cup, Cup Winners Cup and Inter City Fairs Cup !
  • brett
    Posts: 665
    are we agreeing again? or have you forgot to put the internet symbol for sarcasm up there. it annoys me that i can read body language and tones of voices so well, but the internet just confuses me. I can remember the Cup Winners Cup final as though it was yesterday and maybe I am biased but with the fact that poor Chelsea and Liverpool tams have won Champions League did it really have less credibility. That Bayern win was one of toughest games ever
  • NSNO
    Posts: 3,112
    not really sure what point you're trying to make.....Champions league is huge in terms of revenue for clubs....it raises the profile of the club, makes it easier to attract better players, and helps you keep the players you already have (because you can pay them higher wages)......and you're NEVER gonna win the league without qualifying for the champions league first......so if you want Everton buiding a team slowly and challenging for the league (which i think is unrealistic to be honest), then coming 4th would be the necessary first step.....
    as for the fans....ask United fans about the comeback against Bayern Munich.....ask Liverpool fans about the comeback against AC Milan...
  • brett
    Posts: 665
    not denying how crucial its become..just whether that is a good thing in the long term. Neither of the two games mentioned stick in the mind any more than wins in the old European Cup for either team, and they were exceptions in terms of what is usually on offer...and because we arent there I have been watching in recent years as a neutral and found the games lacking in passion and interest. Only really turn on now for prospect of Man U getting beat....I don't know anyone who is more aware of certain players because of Champions League as opposed to what they do at league level or internationals
  • escla
    Posts: 2,453
    brett said:

    are we agreeing again? or have you forgot to put the internet symbol for sarcasm up there. it annoys me that i can read body language and tones of voices so well, but the internet just confuses me. I can remember the Cup Winners Cup final as though it was yesterday and maybe I am biased but with the fact that poor Chelsea and Liverpool tams have won Champions League did it really have less credibility. That Bayern win was one of toughest games ever


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    Deadly serious ! Will never forget that night in Rotterdam !



  • NSNO
    Posts: 3,112
    brett said:

    not denying how crucial its become..just whether that is a good thing in the long term. Neither of the two games mentioned stick in the mind any more than wins in the old European Cup for either team, and they were exceptions in terms of what is usually on offer...and because we arent there I have been watching in recent years as a neutral and found the games lacking in passion and interest. Only really turn on now for prospect of Man U getting beat....I don't know anyone who is more aware of certain players because of Champions League as opposed to what they do at league level or internationals


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    how can you not enjoying watching teams like Ajax & Dortmund this season.....the level of quality football in the champs league is miles better than what you see in the prem league....Man City are getting destroyed.....watching celtic vs Barca last week was fantastic.....all Barca games are.....Schalke & Munich are always good to watch too...
  • brett
    Posts: 665
    ok will confess here, i haven't got Sky so it is down to whether I can summon energy to engineer a night in pub. I did for Celtic game and was amazing night. But that could have happened in old european Cup or Uefa Cup. don't doubt there are good teams, great games. But there is a cost that is bigger than it used to be. the top four was very flexibile in the past and not an elite that you had to try hard to break into..andin the past all the other European tourmaments had much more credibility and excitement than the Europa does
  • brett
    Posts: 665
    escla said:



    Deadly serious ! Will never forget that night in Rotterdam !


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    I rememeber the football and the celebration from the final, but in terms of everything football is about the second leg of the semi will never be matched. Both Bayern and Everton were probably better than any of the teams competing in the European cup. absolute will of player and fans got us to the final that year
  • NSNO
    Posts: 3,112
    brett said:

    ok will confess here, i haven't got Sky so it is down to whether I can summon energy to engineer a night in pub. I did for Celtic game and was amazing night. But that could have happened in old european Cup or Uefa Cup. don't doubt there are good teams, great games. But there is a cost that is bigger than it used to be. the top four was very flexibile in the past and not an elite that you had to try hard to break into..andin the past all the other European tourmaments had much more credibility and excitement than the Europa does


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    i def agree on the Europa.....i've no interest in Everton being in that......
  • Snowcone
    Posts: 6,776
    So what is the truth?
  • OldGoldenVision
    Posts: 19,512
    I'd rather win the league than the CL if that  helps brett?
  • brett
    Posts: 665
    no idea what truth is..that is why put question mark...cheap marketing gimick
  • brett
    Posts: 665
    OldGoldenVision said:

    null


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    helps a lot
  • OldGoldenVision
    Posts: 19,512
    brett said:

    helps a lot


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    ;-)
  • brett
    Posts: 665
    seeing how two English teams that finished fifth have won the CL then hardly seems worth winning
  • OldGoldenVision
    Posts: 19,512
    seeing how two English teams that finished fifth have won the CL then hardly seems worth winning

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    It would be interesting to see how the figures stack up.  Yes you get loads for making it into the CL but you also then have to spend loads to be in it... and if you don't stay in year after year... the players who've bled you dry will move on...

    For me, the CL should only be about the champions.  Like you say, this talk of finishing top 4... sucks a bit.. and as happy as you'd be winning the CL... as you can see with Chelsea... Their chants of "champions of europe" are a bit cringe worthy..
  • Beano
    Posts: 3,283
    It's all a farce!

    It is....I mean really. This Champions League lark....Its a farce!

    Trying to qualify for it...is a farce.

    Trying to make a decent impression in it would be a farce.

    It's as corrupt as _fuck!

    It's all about the biggest and richest clubs making sure they remain as the biggest and richest clubs and stamping on anyone who tries to crash their party.

    Man City are the perfect example of that - anyone who doesn't see that they were INTENTIONALLY shafted in their game against Ajax 2 weeks ago is a _fucking twit!
    There were decisions in that game that no reasonable person could tell me were genuine officiating errors.
    And it's happened them before. And will again - UEFA hates them!

    Just watch Celtic, if necessary, get screwed later in the season for having the nerve to knock out someone like Benfica (if they're not screwed before that).

    People laugh at me when I go on about this.....but they're supporters of Man Utd and the like.....it suits them not to see it!
  • OldGoldenVision
    Posts: 19,512
    "People laugh at me when I go on about this.....but they're supporters of Man Utd and the like.....it suits them not to see it! "

    Hahaha... conspiracy theorist... I like it...

    Does the same ring true for the FA and premier league?
  • Beano
    Posts: 3,283
    OldGoldenVision said:

    null


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    I object to being labeled a consiparcy theroist.
    Conspiracy theorists are twits too - the one's who believe every conspiracy theory going!
    But so are the people who believe there are none!

    And yes! :D

  • OldGoldenVision
    Posts: 19,512
    Beano said:

    I object to being labeled a consiparcy theroist.
    Conspiracy theorists are twits too - the one's who believe every conspiracy theory going!
    But so are the people who believe there are none!

    And yes! :D


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    hahaha WORD!
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