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What the **** is David Moyes doing?
  • Kush Heights
    Posts: 28
    what kind of starting eleven is that? Why is gueye and barkley on the bench and cahill and neville on the field ohh **** david come on and stop **** your self.
  • Kush Heights
    Posts: 28
    I can't see why Neville continues to play he is creating absolutely nothing and cahill is well below his best. If he wants to play neville then drop hibbert and play him at right back
  • Pearse
    Posts: 558
    Far too defensive. Even if we are creating chances, we have no one in the right places to finish them off and we certainly don't have the quality up front to finish them. Gueye, Strac, Barkley and Vellios should have started instead. Some of them better come on at the start of the 2nd half
  • MavisCruet
    Posts: 1,794
    Do people here really think that any of our strikers are good enough to replace Saha?

    I sympathise with the complaints about negativity, but Vellios I don't think has what it takes yet to lead a team, nor Guaye, Strac got hammered on here every time he played bar the last game, Barkley gives it away too much.

    We went today to not lose. We didn't.

    I would love to win too, but we haven't the personnel to do it, or the funding to pay for them, maybe now, our wage bill being so much lower, we might have a chance of getting someone in. Till then, it till Saha can turn it round a bit, not getting a kicking from sides like Sunderland will do me.
  • deso1957bc
    Posts: 545

    MavisCruet said:

    Do people here really think that any of our strikers are good enough to replace Saha?

    I sympathise with the complaints about negativity, but Vellios I don't think has what it takes yet to lead a team, nor Guaye, Strac got hammered on here every time he played bar the last game, Barkley gives it away too much.

    We went today to not lose. We didn't.

    I would love to win too, but we haven't the personnel to do it, or the funding to pay for them, maybe now, our wage bill being so much lower, we might have a chance of getting someone in. Till then, it till Saha can turn it round a bit, not getting a kicking from sides like Sunderland will do me.


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    Moyes has a philosophy...if you can't win,or don't think you can win,then.....at all costs....don't lose.
    MavisCruet said:

    Do people here really think that any of our strikers are good enough to replace Saha?

    I sympathise with the complaints about negativity, but Vellios I don't think has what it takes yet to lead a team, nor Guaye, Strac got hammered on here every time he played bar the last game, Barkley gives it away too much.

    We went today to not lose. We didn't.

    I would love to win too, but we haven't the personnel to do it, or the funding to pay for them, maybe now, our wage bill being so much lower, we might have a chance of getting someone in. Till then, it till Saha can turn it round a bit, not getting a kicking from sides like Sunderland will do me.


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  • MavisCruet
    Posts: 1,794

    Well it's not a bad thing per se.  I would rather get a point than none.  Telling comment from Moyes in the post match, "Leighton Baines put in some world-class crosses. Any centre-forward worth their salt would be begging to get on the end of them."

    Sums up what he thinks of his strikers I guess.

  • mattyod
    Posts: 305
    Moyes continually blames the strikers but what can they do? We had 6 defenders on the pitch and a Goalie. That left 4 players to get us goals. One point is better than none but if we don't try and win we will never get up the league. Even against Swansea we had Neville in the middle and he was never in the game. Felliani broke down most their plays and going forward Neville always dropped back into the centre circle.

    I feel we have a strong enough defensive unit without a second DM in the middle. Give that space to an attacking player. Also stop putting Osman out wide, play him in the middle or not at all.

    We keep complaining about the personal but with teams like sunderland , Stoke, Norwich and Swansea we should be offering more going forward.
  • MavisCruet
    Posts: 1,794

    I wholly agree with everything you say there.  Fellaini and Neville should be either or, unless Nev is at right back, and then he should never be allowed to pass forward.  Add Rodwell, or indeed Heitinga in there and we really lack forward pressure, though I don't think Heitinga as limited as Nev there.

    Baines shouldn't be discounted as an attacking number though, he's certainly not there as the best defender on earth.

    In theory you could have both DMs spread wide to cover attacks moving full backs beyond them, but then that would assume you're having Hibbo as an attacking threat.

    I think we are just hugely struggling to get players in.

    We have cut our wage bill significantly, Peanuts, Arteta, Yak, Beckford were all on good money (I assume the last one, as he was a free and we weren't the only option).  That can have saved us millions in the last year.  That with sales of well over £10m might mean we can get someone in.  Donovan I hope will resume a right wide/wing forward role, Ossie can therefore play behind the striker(s) if at all (and Cahill isn't doing it).

    I think in a few years a midfield three of Rodwell, Barkley and Fellaini would be utterly immense, if we can keep them.

    The one thing I lament is the Bily was never (assuming he is off as seems to be) the chance to play that in the hole role, it's where he played before he came here, and did it well, I just wonder what he could have brought.  Then again, he's less of a player in Russia's eyes than Arseshaving, and he's been rubbish for the past year.

  • mattyod
    Posts: 305
    I would love to see Coleman Right Back and see if he can offer an option like Baines does. He crossing is not great but he can give the RM support that Hibbert or Neville have never done. This would give balance on the flanks and give Osman the chance to switch play or go direct up the middle.

    We are too predictable and it is down to too many midfielders with a defensive midset.
  • MavisCruet
    Posts: 1,794

    I am still undecided about Coleman.  I remember his debut against... er, a Portuguese team and the pace and fearlessness were fantastic.  The latter naturally fades, but I do wonder about his technique, as you say, his delivery isn't great, though he can beat a man (the poor man's Aaron Lennon?).  However he certainly gives the opposing fullback more to worry about than Hibbo.  I worry about how he si defending though, Nev and Hibbo are both good at the back.

    I do think Hibbo should carry on playing till he scores. 

  • mattyod
    Posts: 305
    Lets hope its soon then.

    I think we should play like the Brazil of old. Cafu Coleman RB and Reberto Baines on the other with Dunga Fellaini controlling the middle. We might lose a few goals but we would definitely start creating and be in a positions to see if any of are strikers has got what it takes. Add to that Drenthe and Donovan infront of them and we would be awesome
  • MavisCruet
    Posts: 1,794
    We just need a Fat Ronaldo,  What's Adriano doing these days?
  • sambo applecart
    Posts: 24,216
    Pearse said:

    Far too defensive. Even if we are creating chances, we have no one in the right places to finish them off and we certainly don't have the quality up front to finish them. Gueye, Strac, Barkley and Vellios should have started instead. Some of them better come on at the start of the 2nd half


    -----------------



    thats a contradiction of terms that Pearse mate, how can you be defensive but still creating chances??? Sounds like the tactics are working to me.....
  • Pearse
    Posts: 558

    sambo applecart said:

    Pearse said:

    Far too defensive. Even if we are creating chances, we have no one in the right places to finish them off and we certainly don't have the quality up front to finish them. Gueye, Strac, Barkley and Vellios should have started instead. Some of them better come on at the start of the 2nd half


    -----------------



    thats a contradiction of terms that Pearse mate, how can you be defensive but still creating chances??? Sounds like the tactics are working to me.....

    -----------------



    You shouldn't have just read the first 9 words of my post lad. Too defensive meaning too many players sitting back when the likes of Baines were crossing the ball into  the box. Vellios or another forward player on instead of Neville or Heitinga would have got forward in and around the box and made more of those crosses and chances. As I said in another post, the amount of times I heard Moyes on the sideline saying good ball when one of our many defenders hoofed the ball up the field to no one. Our football, if you could call it that was embarrassing at times. Baines and Osman were the only two who did something going forward yesterday. (Drenthe had an off day) so they deserve credit.
  • sambo applecart
    Posts: 24,216
    Pearse said:


    sambo applecart said:

    Pearse said:

    Far too defensive. Even if we are creating chances, we have no one in the right places to finish them off and we certainly don't have the quality up front to finish them. Gueye, Strac, Barkley and Vellios should have started instead. Some of them better come on at the start of the 2nd half


    -----------------



    thats a contradiction of terms that Pearse mate, how can you be defensive but still creating chances??? Sounds like the tactics are working to me.....

    -----------------



    You shouldn't have just read the first 9 words of my post lad. Too defensive meaning too many players sitting back when the likes of Baines were crossing the ball into  the box. Vellios or another forward player on instead of Neville or Heitinga would have got forward in and around the box and made more of those crosses and chances. As I said in another post, the amount of times I heard Moyes on the sideline saying good ball when one of our many defenders hoofed the ball up the field to no one. Our football, if you could call it that was embarrassing at times. Baines and Osman were the only two who did something going forward yesterday. (Drenthe had an off day) so they deserve credit.

    -----------------




    WOULD YOU PREFER HE SHOUTED CRAP BALL?? lololol
  • tickets11
    Posts: 1,002

    problem with moyes is its like he is going backwards in his development.

    people keep on bringing up the same crap "he brought in cahill jags and lescott" "all of those top5/6 finishes"

    were not that team anymore ffs.

    I cant beleive moyes was mentioned as the guy to succeed ferguson at united.  I dont even think spurs would look at him when redknapp leaves. and the brand of football he has us playing is ****.  its obvious he needs a new challenge.

  • sambo applecart
    Posts: 24,216
    tickets11 said:

    problem with moyes is its like he is going backwards in his development.

    people keep on bringing up the same crap "he brought in cahill jags and lescott" "all of those top5/6 finishes"

    were not that team anymore ffs.

    I cant beleive moyes was mentioned as the guy to succeed ferguson at united.  I dont even think spurs would look at him when redknapp leaves. and the brand of football he has us playing is ****.  its obvious he needs a new challenge.


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    he's not become a bad manager though mate, we just dont have the resource or the players we once had. imo of course. 
  • Pearse
    Posts: 558
    sambo applecart said:

    Pearse said:


    sambo applecart said:

    Pearse said:

    Far too defensive. Even if we are creating chances, we have no one in the right places to finish them off and we certainly don't have the quality up front to finish them. Gueye, Strac, Barkley and Vellios should have started instead. Some of them better come on at the start of the 2nd half


    -----------------



    thats a contradiction of terms that Pearse mate, how can you be defensive but still creating chances??? Sounds like the tactics are working to me.....

    -----------------



    You shouldn't have just read the first 9 words of my post lad. Too defensive meaning too many players sitting back when the likes of Baines were crossing the ball into  the box. Vellios or another forward player on instead of Neville or Heitinga would have got forward in and around the box and made more of those crosses and chances. As I said in another post, the amount of times I heard Moyes on the sideline saying good ball when one of our many defenders hoofed the ball up the field to no one. Our football, if you could call it that was embarrassing at times. Baines and Osman were the only two who did something going forward yesterday. (Drenthe had an off day) so they deserve credit.

    -----------------




    WOULD YOU PREFER HE SHOUTED CRAP BALL?? lololol

    -----------------



    Well if he thinks that kind of football is "good" enough for Premier League then he souldn't be managing us. We have good enough players and we had been playing beautiful football a few seasons back that got us European football. Unfortunately we lost Pienaar and Arteta but we do have the players to fill their boots. Moyes just has to trust them. We can't play with both Neville and Heitinga siting back who can hardly string two passes together. I know we have a few injuries but Moyes has to trust the younger lads and give them a chance from the start. We play much better with them in the team.
  • sambo applecart
    Posts: 24,216
    Pearse said:

    sambo applecart said:

    Pearse said:


    sambo applecart said:

    Pearse said:

    Far too defensive. Even if we are creating chances, we have no one in the right places to finish them off and we certainly don't have the quality up front to finish them. Gueye, Strac, Barkley and Vellios should have started instead. Some of them better come on at the start of the 2nd half


    -----------------



    thats a contradiction of terms that Pearse mate, how can you be defensive but still creating chances??? Sounds like the tactics are working to me.....

    -----------------



    You shouldn't have just read the first 9 words of my post lad. Too defensive meaning too many players sitting back when the likes of Baines were crossing the ball into  the box. Vellios or another forward player on instead of Neville or Heitinga would have got forward in and around the box and made more of those crosses and chances. As I said in another post, the amount of times I heard Moyes on the sideline saying good ball when one of our many defenders hoofed the ball up the field to no one. Our football, if you could call it that was embarrassing at times. Baines and Osman were the only two who did something going forward yesterday. (Drenthe had an off day) so they deserve credit.

    -----------------




    WOULD YOU PREFER HE SHOUTED CRAP BALL?? lololol

    -----------------



    Well if he thinks that kind of football is "good" enough for Premier League then he souldn't be managing us. We have good enough players and we had been playing beautiful football a few seasons back that got us European football. Unfortunately we lost Pienaar and Arteta but we do have the players to fill their boots. Moyes just has to trust them. We can't play with both Neville and Heitinga siting back who can hardly string two passes together. I know we have a few injuries but Moyes has to trust the younger lads and give them a chance from the start. We play much better with them in the team.

    -----------------





    he dont play the young lads mate so how do you know we play better with them in the team??
  • mattyod
    Posts: 305
    sambo applecart said:

    tickets11 said:

    problem with moyes is its like he is going backwards in his development.

    people keep on bringing up the same crap "he brought in cahill jags and lescott" "all of those top5/6 finishes"

    were not that team anymore ffs.

    I cant beleive moyes was mentioned as the guy to succeed ferguson at united.  I dont even think spurs would look at him when redknapp leaves. and the brand of football he has us playing is ****.  its obvious he needs a new challenge.


    -----------------




    he's not become a bad manager though mate, we just dont have the resource or the players we once had. imo of course. 


    I don't think we can always blame the resources. We have 4 strikers (not including Anchebe) but choose to only play with 1. We have Osman and Barkley who could offer some creativity in the middle but Barkley doesnt get a game and Ossie plays on the wing. Even Billy deserves a game in the middle as this is apparently his stronger position. We have Gueye who only gets a game in place of Drenthe when surely we could start with both.

    Moyes said that we lost Felliani and Rodwell in the middle and therefore lost our creativity? Why not then give Barkley a go instead of picking 2 defenders in the center of our midfield.

    He had success with Cahill in 2010 scoring goals and sticks with it eventhough it has not worked for a year. Nearly every player at the club has been brought in by him so if they are not good enough then he is t blame.
  • Pearse
    Posts: 558
    sambo applecart said:

    Pearse said:

    sambo applecart said:

    Pearse said:


    sambo applecart said:

    Pearse said:

    Far too defensive. Even if we are creating chances, we have no one in the right places to finish them off and we certainly don't have the quality up front to finish them. Gueye, Strac, Barkley and Vellios should have started instead. Some of them better come on at the start of the 2nd half


    -----------------



    thats a contradiction of terms that Pearse mate, how can you be defensive but still creating chances??? Sounds like the tactics are working to me.....

    -----------------



    You shouldn't have just read the first 9 words of my post lad. Too defensive meaning too many players sitting back when the likes of Baines were crossing the ball into  the box. Vellios or another forward player on instead of Neville or Heitinga would have got forward in and around the box and made more of those crosses and chances. As I said in another post, the amount of times I heard Moyes on the sideline saying good ball when one of our many defenders hoofed the ball up the field to no one. Our football, if you could call it that was embarrassing at times. Baines and Osman were the only two who did something going forward yesterday. (Drenthe had an off day) so they deserve credit.

    -----------------




    WOULD YOU PREFER HE SHOUTED CRAP BALL?? lololol

    -----------------



    Well if he thinks that kind of football is "good" enough for Premier League then he souldn't be managing us. We have good enough players and we had been playing beautiful football a few seasons back that got us European football. Unfortunately we lost Pienaar and Arteta but we do have the players to fill their boots. Moyes just has to trust them. We can't play with both Neville and Heitinga siting back who can hardly string two passes together. I know we have a few injuries but Moyes has to trust the younger lads and give them a chance from the start. We play much better with them in the team.

    -----------------





    he dont play the young lads mate so how do you know we play better with them in the team??

    -----------------



    He does in the last 10mins of matches. McAleney had a great effort against Aresenal just wide. Vellios is always in and around the goal when he comes on. Guyeye can cause problems when he drives forward with the ball. I've forgotten how Barkley plays because Moyes hasn't put him on in ages but do remember him playing attractive football. Do you know how our last couple of goals came from. Players like Osman and Drenthe driving forward with the ball causing problems. The younger players I've mentioned do this in matches too. They'd be more effective on the field than Neville or Heitinga, simple as.
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