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Moyes & 442
  • jwollnick
    Posts: 172
    He`s actually utilised it with good results.


  • xreyuk123
    Posts: 785
    Yeah, but he won't use it. Too stubborn.
  • Warrington Dan
    Posts: 8,859
    To fair not many managers use it. I know Newcastle use it but they're only on a good run you have to look at the better teams. 

    City - 4-2-3-1
    Man Utd - They use 4-5-1 with Rooney in Midfield and before Rooney was in midfield they played 4-4-1-1
    Arsenal - 4-2-3-1/4-3-3
    Chelsea - 4-3-3
    Barca - 4-3-3
    Real Madrid - 4-2-3-1
  • 11blue
    Posts: 4,680

    Warrington Dan said:

    To fair not many managers use it. I know Newcastle use it but they're only on a good run you have to look at the better teams. 


    City - 4-2-3-1
    Man Utd - They use 4-5-1 with Rooney in Midfield and before Rooney was in midfield they played 4-4-1-1
    Arsenal - 4-2-3-1/4-3-3
    Chelsea - 4-3-3
    Barca - 4-3-3
    Real Madrid - 4-2-3-1

    -----------------



    City play Dzeko up front but they play Silva, Toure and Aguero behind him, which is different to playing one striker and a second striker like Moyes plays. Barcelona, Chelsea and Arsenal play 4 3 3 and Man United usually play 4 4 2 with Welbeck and Hernandez up front with Rooney playing a bit deeper, so in a way they are also playing 4 3 3! The best teams in the league play attacking formations and are fearless, I believe that he give far too much respect to the opposition. We are far too negative and predictable and we have to change our style of play, but will we?
  • Ivdlit
    Posts: 2,044
    Nothing remains the same. Though I hope too, that we soon get to see some good change. Gotta be. Or else that our same players get on and fight for us.
  • Warrington Dan
    Posts: 8,859
    11blue said:


    Warrington Dan said:

    To fair not many managers use it. I know Newcastle use it but they're only on a good run you have to look at the better teams. 


    City - 4-2-3-1
    Man Utd - They use 4-5-1 with Rooney in Midfield and before Rooney was in midfield they played 4-4-1-1
    Arsenal - 4-2-3-1/4-3-3
    Chelsea - 4-3-3
    Barca - 4-3-3
    Real Madrid - 4-2-3-1

    -----------------



    City play Dzeko up front but they play Silva, Toure and Aguero behind him, which is different to playing one striker and a second striker like Moyes plays. Barcelona, Chelsea and Arsenal play 4 3 3 and Man United usually play 4 4 2 with Welbeck and Hernandez up front with Rooney playing a bit deeper, so in a way they are also playing 4 3 3! The best teams in the league play attacking formations and are fearless, I believe that he give far too much respect to the opposition. We are far too negative and predictable and we have to change our style of play, but will we?

    -----------------



    City play nasri, milner and many many more different players behind the striker because they have so many but it doesn't matter how you look at it it's 4-2-3-and 1 up top. 

    Man Utd never play Welbeck and Hernandez upfront together except maybe against much lesser teams. Rooney plays just behind the striker although recently he's been playing centre mid. 

    The 3 teams that play 4-3-3 play 1 striker with 2 advanced wingers. Although a striker may operate one of these advanced winger roles they are playing out wide. 
  • Daive521
    Posts: 2,329
    Not much Change?
  • Beano
    Posts: 3,287

    Why not post up a thread about our more recent games against Chelsea. Maybe the 4 games last season where we beat them in the league, knocked them out of the FA Cup and also got a draw at the bridge in the league...all playing 4-4-1-1 or 4-1-3-1-1

    Or terrible results last season like a 2-2 home draw against the league whipping boys, West Ham, while playing 4-4-2 and actually losing the game - until we went back to 4-4-1-1 for the last 20 minutes and came back

    Or even go more recent again and show the highlights of us going out of the Carling Cup after extra time while playing the extra time with 2 strikers also!
  • Beano
    Posts: 3,287
    .....accidental double post.....
  • 11blue
    Posts: 4,680
    Warrington Dan said:

    11blue said:


    Warrington Dan said:

    To fair not many managers use it. I know Newcastle use it but they're only on a good run you have to look at the better teams. 


    City - 4-2-3-1
    Man Utd - They use 4-5-1 with Rooney in Midfield and before Rooney was in midfield they played 4-4-1-1
    Arsenal - 4-2-3-1/4-3-3
    Chelsea - 4-3-3
    Barca - 4-3-3
    Real Madrid - 4-2-3-1

    -----------------



    City play Dzeko up front but they play Silva, Toure and Aguero behind him, which is different to playing one striker and a second striker like Moyes plays. Barcelona, Chelsea and Arsenal play 4 3 3 and Man United usually play 4 4 2 with Welbeck and Hernandez up front with Rooney playing a bit deeper, so in a way they are also playing 4 3 3! The best teams in the league play attacking formations and are fearless, I believe that he give far too much respect to the opposition. We are far too negative and predictable and we have to change our style of play, but will we?

    -----------------



    City play nasri, milner and many many more different players behind the striker because they have so many but it doesn't matter how you look at it it's 4-2-3-and 1 up top. 

    Man Utd never play Welbeck and Hernandez upfront together except maybe against much lesser teams. Rooney plays just behind the striker although recently he's been playing centre mid. 

    The 3 teams that play 4-3-3 play 1 striker with 2 advanced wingers. Although a striker may operate one of these advanced winger roles they are playing out wide. 

    -----------------



    4 3 3, 4 2 2 and 4 2 3 1 are all attacking formations, much more attacking than 4 4 1 1. Don't forget we play with a player who hasn't scored for 11 months and a lazy striker who spends most of the game standing in the centre circle. You also said that Man U play 4 4 2 only against lesser teams, so why don't we do that?
  • HOWIE8
    Posts: 7,570
    We havent got the quality box to box midfield to play 4-4-2, Moyes knows it.............
  • 11blue
    Posts: 4,680
    HOWIE8 said:

    We havent got the quality box to box midfield to play 4-4-2, Moyes knows it.............


    -----------------



    Have we got any quality!
  • HOWIE8
    Posts: 7,570
    11blue said:

    HOWIE8 said:

    We havent got the quality box to box midfield to play 4-4-2, Moyes knows it.............


    -----------------



    Have we got any quality!


    Say it quietly so Milky doesnt hear, yes FELLAINI...........
  • sambo applecart
    Posts: 24,216
    HOWIE8 said:

    11blue said:

    HOWIE8 said:

    We havent got the quality box to box midfield to play 4-4-2, Moyes knows it.............


    -----------------



    Have we got any quality!


    Say it quietly so Milky doesnt hear, yes FELLAINI...........

    -----------------




    i agree, fellaini has amazing feet for a big guy.
  • 11blue
    Posts: 4,680
    I think Baines, Fellaini and Drenthe are the only genuinely good players in our team.
  • sambo applecart
    Posts: 24,216
    11blue said:

    I think Baines, Fellaini and Drenthe are the only genuinely good players in our team.


    -----------------




    Howard
  • HOWIE8
    Posts: 7,570
    Hibbo
  • 11blue
    Posts: 4,680
    sambo applecart said:

    11blue said:

    I think Baines, Fellaini and Drenthe are the only genuinely good players in our team.


    -----------------




    Howard

    -----------------



    I forgot about Tim, he deserves a mention because he is a fantastic keeper in my opinion.
  • sambo applecart
    Posts: 24,216
    11blue said:

    sambo applecart said:

    11blue said:

    I think Baines, Fellaini and Drenthe are the only genuinely good players in our team.


    -----------------




    Howard

    -----------------



    I forgot about Tim, he deserves a mention because he is a fantastic keeper in my opinion.

    -----------------



    i agree
  • milky71
    Posts: 8,778
    The formation isn't a problem in my eyes.

    It's getting the best from the players and playing the best players in their positions not your best players and tring to fit them into a team.

    Also being able to change the game tactically if your starting formation isn't working.

    This was highlighted against Newcastle,.

    We were 2 nil down whilst playing a full back in CM Moyes brings on a CB and moves our CB into mdfield.

    Being 2-0 down should have shown that our tactics weren't working but Moyes persisted with it.

  • Warrington Dan
    Posts: 8,859
    11blue said:

    Warrington Dan said:

    11blue said:


    Warrington Dan said:

    To fair not many managers use it. I know Newcastle use it but they're only on a good run you have to look at the better teams. 


    City - 4-2-3-1
    Man Utd - They use 4-5-1 with Rooney in Midfield and before Rooney was in midfield they played 4-4-1-1
    Arsenal - 4-2-3-1/4-3-3
    Chelsea - 4-3-3
    Barca - 4-3-3
    Real Madrid - 4-2-3-1

    -----------------



    City play Dzeko up front but they play Silva, Toure and Aguero behind him, which is different to playing one striker and a second striker like Moyes plays. Barcelona, Chelsea and Arsenal play 4 3 3 and Man United usually play 4 4 2 with Welbeck and Hernandez up front with Rooney playing a bit deeper, so in a way they are also playing 4 3 3! The best teams in the league play attacking formations and are fearless, I believe that he give far too much respect to the opposition. We are far too negative and predictable and we have to change our style of play, but will we?

    -----------------



    City play nasri, milner and many many more different players behind the striker because they have so many but it doesn't matter how you look at it it's 4-2-3-and 1 up top. 

    Man Utd never play Welbeck and Hernandez upfront together except maybe against much lesser teams. Rooney plays just behind the striker although recently he's been playing centre mid. 

    The 3 teams that play 4-3-3 play 1 striker with 2 advanced wingers. Although a striker may operate one of these advanced winger roles they are playing out wide. 

    -----------------



    4 3 3, 4 2 2 and 4 2 3 1 are all attacking formations, much more attacking than 4 4 1 1. Don't forget we play with a player who hasn't scored for 11 months and a lazy striker who spends most of the game standing in the centre circle. You also said that Man U play 4 4 2 only against lesser teams, so why don't we do that?

    -----------------



    We just don't have the players for that formation. We need Cahill just to join up the midfield and attack because without him the striker has no service. TBH I wouldn't mind us playing 5-4-1 if it go the results! Only 3 league wins all season, not good enough!
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